JollyMole

Heater- Cold Air ONLY

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Hey Folks,

Recently purchased a 2.0d hatchback. It only has one issue thus far which is that it only blows cold air with or without AC on, with the engine hot AND cold.

It's a strange one, i presumed at first it would be a thermostat issue, however, the pipes to the rad are warm as they should be and, although the engine takes a long time to heat up, it does eventually. The pipes going into the bulkhead towards the heater are stone cold, no matter how hot the engine gets.

As it's now a 10 year old car i'm going to swap the thermostat and flush the coolant anyway, replacing with some nice red longlife stuff but.. I'm gonna be stuck if that doesn't solve the issue.

Any guesses, folks?

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Does sound like an air lock, when you replace the coolant jack the front of the car up to ensure it goes to the bulkhead - I pull the one of the hoses as well just to be sure but it is not always necessary 

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So I'm waiting for a bit of a weather break to get the job done and i realised i may aswell try and use the valve near the bulkhead to try and burp what's already in, get some heat on my windows etc with the bad weather... then i noticed something.

bulk.thumb.jpg.c3e65c558c0770b4121beae70cfd628d.jpg

Erm... yeah.. there's a pipe missing...

 

top.thumb.jpg.fe6cbe0ec6f743bc5fad5ffd80d05437.jpg

Wait a second

COMPRESSOR.thumb.jpg.6d8247a559458952d78166c9e93664b5.jpg

There's no sodding pipes for my AC!

Dont buy at a distance. lmao.

SOLD AS SEEN so, i'm stuck with it either way, now the question is, would the AC system being, well, MIA, cause cold air only? I had the valve loose to burp the coolant but nothing has changed. . .

So, is this one issue, or two? What's the thoughts?

Added: There's also no battery clamp. D'oh!

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No you should still get warm air from the heat unit behind dash which gets its heat from the engine

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Two seperate issues then, thankfully. Need heat ASAP with the weather being as is and as expected. 😞

And then today i've got a squeal coming from the turbo, will get a video of somepoint. Doesn't happen when sat stationary and raising revs, only when the car is under load.

bought a lemon? hahaha

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The top of the 2 pipes for the heater looks like it has a bleed valve on it, loosen it and see if you get coolant coming from it

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On 2/15/2020 at 1:26 PM, Neil said:

The top of the 2 pipes for the heater looks like it has a bleed valve on it, loosen it and see if you get coolant coming from it

Yeah, see below

On 2/13/2020 at 6:12 PM, JollyMole said:

i may aswell try and use the valve near the bulkhead to try and burp what's already in

So i did have it completely open, the screw in part completely out of the valve and nothing changed. I should have just removed the whole thing like you suggest though, see if theres actually anything goign through it.

I did put my finger over the hole to see if there was suction or air escaping from it but felt neither.

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Today I've gotten the video of the noise, for reference, noise when stationary as above. (no noise)

Below as when moving (noise)

Yep, thats 324miles since i bought the car... haha. The noise is definitely coming from the driverside of the engine bay.

Also have a small oil leak what appears to be coming out of the intake on drivers side. Going to whip that off today and check Orings whilst checking all the platic and rubber pipework from air intake>turbo>intercooler>throttle then outwards. Will see if i can get a pair of small grips to give the turbo fan a wiggle to check for wear.

ANY help, ideas etc are more than welcome and greatly appreciated.

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 So.. This is the pipe down from filter box into turboSo, this is the pipe down from air filter to turbo intake side. Has a nice crease in the end of it.

Part A12AG05

All the ones I can see online for sale have no such crease.

 

Suspect #1 for noise cause!

IMG_20200217_150201.jpg

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This part also has a split in, this is the connector pipe that fits onto this folded edge then direct onto turbo. This little slit in the seal is on the turbo side too. So... Will be getting replaced regardless

IMG_20200217_151913.jpg

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Refitted as shown above, reshaped. Checked all clamps tight etc etc

Noise still there

Checked turbo shaft while I was down ther

 

To my untrained eye play looks normal, no front to back at all and very little side to side. No taps of a bent vane or anything like that.

So, any ideas of what noise could be that is not potentially that little slit in part 14462aa410 please do speak up. 🙂

 

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You should get coolant out of that bleed, with engine off bleed open fill coolant to top should push air out if that dont work try having it vacuum bled

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22 hours ago, Neil said:

You should get coolant out of that bleed, with engine off bleed open fill coolant to top should push air out if that dont work try having it vacuum bled

Vacuum pump kit ordered! Couldn't get one today from local motor stores so due on Friday.

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Vacuum pump coming tomorrow.

Pipe replacement came today, fitted, no difference. Still got the noise.

A Facebook page has suggested that it could be the turbo assembly gaskets.

 

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Vacuum kit arrived today, took a lot of pumping but i finally got the circulation going through all the pipes. Heaters are now no longer ICE cold, but aren't going warm.

There is also no pressure build up in the pipes to the rad and no hiss as cap comes off, even when up to tempurature.

Thermostat stuck open?

Turbo assembly gasket kit in delivery

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Any idea what thermostat is in it? Petrol Subis prefer OEM tstats, not sure about diesels.

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16 hours ago, Greenmamba said:

Any idea what thermostat is in it? Petrol Subis prefer OEM tstats, not sure about diesels.

Not a clue what is in at the minute. I have a thermostat which I got from import car parts sat waiting to be fitted. Just never stops raining when I have free time haha.

I just hope I don't swap it out, all coolant etc to find it's the heater matrix all along lol.

 

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I am also an untrained eye and the play in the turbo looks bad to me. Has anyone else watched the video? They spin a 100K rpm plus so ther should be virtually zero play no? Ok I have just checked and it does seem ok. You learn something every day. Ignore me

Edit: the play is taken out with the oil when it is feed into the turbo bearing and shaft. It makes sense now.

The Garrett full ball-bearing turbo is designed to have clearance between the bearing cartridge and center housing for hydrodynamic damping in addition to the internal clearances of the bearing cartridge itself. Hydrodynamic damping uses the incompressible properties of a liquid (oil in this case) and the space around the bearing cartridge to dampen the shaft motion of the rotating assembly. When the turbo is new, or has not operated for a long period of time allowing most of the oil to drain out, the rotating assembly will move more in the radial direction than a typical journal-bearing turbo because there is no oil in the center housing. This condition is normal. As long as the shaft wheel spins freely and the wheels don't contact their respective housings, the assembly will function properly.

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1 hour ago, JollyMole said:

Not a clue what is in at the minute. I have a thermostat which I got from import car parts sat waiting to be fitted. Just never stops raining when I have free time haha.

I just hope I don't swap it out, all coolant etc to find it's the heater matrix all along lol.

 

When/if you open up to install the new thermostat make sure you burp as much air out of the system when refilling. The heater matrix sits quite high and can be a !Removed! to bleed.

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On 2/21/2020 at 1:07 PM, Siluro said:

I am also an untrained eye and the play in the turbo looks bad to me. Has anyone else watched the video? They spin a 100K rpm plus so ther should be virtually zero play no? Ok I have just checked and it does seem ok. You learn something every day. Ignore me

Edit: the play is taken out with the oil when it is feed into the turbo bearing and shaft. It makes sense now.

The Garrett full ball-bearing turbo is designed to have clearance between the bearing cartridge and center housing for hydrodynamic damping in addition to the internal clearances of the bearing cartridge itself. Hydrodynamic damping uses the incompressible properties of a liquid (oil in this case) and the space around the bearing cartridge to dampen the shaft motion of the rotating assembly. When the turbo is new, or has not operated for a long period of time allowing most of the oil to drain out, the rotating assembly will move more in the radial direction than a typical journal-bearing turbo because there is no oil in the center housing. This condition is normal. As long as the shaft wheel spins freely and the wheels don't contact their respective housings, the assembly will function properly.

Yeah from all accounts i can read and videos it seems to be "normal play" for the turbo. Always willing to learn otherwise though. Did you notice the oil in the bottom though? See below

On 2/21/2020 at 2:39 PM, Greenmamba said:

When/if you open up to install the new thermostat make sure you burp as much air out of the system when refilling. The heater matrix sits quite high and can be a !Removed! to bleed.

So, Yesterday the snow came and i caved into taking it to a garage. Low and behold the thermostat was indeed.... erm... well.. you decide.

thermo1.thumb.jpg.9797295b36a024efe93c788b701631ee.jpg

thermo3.thumb.jpg.35b9d7d888a6f057b386574d62b6d146.jpg

thermo2.thumb.jpg.8d071d1a9b06bdf2677651a682c25bc0.jpg

Now, I must say i have seen a LOT of bad things mechanically over the years, but i'm rarely speechless.

There isn't a straight bit of metal on it and i have no idea how you could damge a thermostat like that, the fold over is particularly impressive. or indeed, WHY?

I genuinely haven't a clue. Scary stuff!

But thermostat out, new one in and heat was better but not great. Garage put a BIG vacuum pump on not my little handheld ebay one and boom, one blob of blockage out of the heater matrix and all is well in that regard, I have heat!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now I only have the issue of the noise from the turbo. I do have a gasket set here to go on the turbo as i've been suggested it as a fix from 3 different people now, however, when the mechanic removed the intercooler (to attach larger vacuum equipment) he noticed "a deposit of oil" and because of which he suggested one of two things:

A) Replace entire turbo
B) Leave as is to not disturb it, as it is still working.

I always believed the entire air intake system on a turbo diesel would be oily due to recirculating gasses, and things like, the turbo intake would always have SOME in there from the pipe going upwards, when air flow stops, it will drip down inside the pipe. Intercooler again, would be subjected to this right down to the intake manifold, where, i've seen videos, the boxer turbos do develop some HEFTY waste build up.

I believe my mechanic, whom i trust, was being cautious as these engines are naturally delicate, and fettling with a turbo may well upset it. But that noise is there, not quiet and it is annoying haha

Thoughts for moving forward?

 

 

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That Thermostat wow. I guess it did not work (open/shut) and someone just permanently opened it.

Did someone have your trouble with trapped air and thought this would help. Mine is a PIA (as most scoobys) to fill and with the slowest poor I still managed to get air trapped in it.

Option B may end badly, is all I can add.

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2 hours ago, JollyMole said:

So, Yesterday the snow came and i caved into taking it to a garage. Low and behold the thermostat was indeed.... erm... well.. you decide

Good job getting it sorted. Might help a bit too with fuel consumption now the engine gets up to optimum temps quicker.

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So, been down and back to Manchester, from Newcastle. Noise still there, but nothing happened apart from a headlight bulb died in the rain/snow.
 

Guess that means full front end Led conversion.

Should I start a separate thread for this noise?

 

 

 

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