Hybrid Forester - Battery Problems

[Wilmac]

Wilmac

my 2019 Forester XT ( 6,800mls) first died in a local car park a week after it’s first service. The dealers (now apparently standard)  response was a faulty Battery, even though this was tested as part of the service and passed? The 60ah Panasonic Battery was replaced with a Varta 100ah Battery last July and of course this initially lasted longer during the summer months. For the past 5 months I have been charging and running the car to boost the voltage which I check regularly, and, if left, within 3 to 4 days the voltage has dropped from 12.57v to around 11 volts, I.e., close to full discharge. One day a couple of weeks ago, it “died” in the drive. Subaru Assist (the AA) came and decided there was a parasitic drain, so the dealer had the car for a full week in February and declared after “extensive” testing that they could find no fault. I have had it back for 10 days and the Battery discharge is as bad as ever. I am an Electrical technician who has worked with batteries all my working life and this is not a battery issue, this is a Subaru software or hardware issue and if you check the Outback forum you will see the same issue there, with confused owners being fobbed off with a battery change. 
Our Fiat 500 has also been parked up for longer than the Subaru and starts first time, every time. Someone at Subaru needs to admit there is a problem as regardless of the waffle, no car should need a charger attached every few days or be so unreliable you can’t leave home without a back-up battery. This is my 4th Subaru and the first to give me these problems. 

 

[Brian R]

have the same problems with my 2017 forester if left in garage for more than 7 days dead Battery only 12,500 miles  3 visit from RAC and now been told by them that Battery needs replaced after only 38 months   Now getting a jump start from me wife's  7 year old polo that's still on original battery   I did ask Subaru dealer 2 years ago if common fault and was told of no other issues reported not much help now as warranty ended    I think Subaru needs to do recall and sort the Battery or software problem

[Mr B]

It quite simply batteries suffering early failure due to fact standard high parked/locked current drawer fatigues the Battery rapidly from too much low charged state .
Obviously some user usage highlights the issue faster but when you can't leave your vehicle for 14 days at airport car park without needing keep a jump pack on standby and keep replacing batteries at a financial cost to someone and an environmental cost to us all 😞
From what I seen I would assume some module software changes could help !
Far too much current drawer and far too many effected and not just a Subaru brand issue. Going be fun dealing with this as an independent garage over next 3 to 6 years when we get see a lot more of them.
Be a bit like the diesel where they sit in our yard until salvage truck turns up as owners lost interest and money and we can't provide a worthwhile fix .

 

[Bozzybear]

I Mr B, I think your take on the situation is pretty much on the money. Currently we use our E Boxer Forester no more than twice per week -local shopping and medical trips to our health centre which is only 500 metres from my house but health issues mean I have to drive. I think its simply an equation whereby every time we use the car we take more out of the Battery than we put in! Our solution to this is a smart Battery charger which we leave connected every day the car isn't used. The big test for us will will come after lockdown when we can drive to restaurants etc and also park in Newcastle cruise terminal for up to 16 nights at least three time per year - something our previous six Subarus had no problem with. I have purchased a jump-start pack and keep it charged for emergencies.

[Mr B]

^
Most of the issue is it takes too much when parked up locked, for sure your sort of usage not ideal but generally starting doesn't take excessive amounts unless extended crank times and with car running you won't be using charge out of Battery
Your driving scenario highlights faults more quickly but it underlying engineering flaws that mainly to blame as even in more ideal driving scenario early Battery fatigue and occasional flat Battery is happening unfortunately . E Boxer is bad for it and no reason for it to be when have a secondary Battery system that can add charge to the 12v and parked sleep mode should have less module activity, it quite simply design/software incompetence.
Having to keep a jump start pack or constantly trickle charging a new £25K+ vehicle is not good or normal lol & it very bad environmentally through short lifespan and amount of extra equipment parts service chemicals and wasted electric time petrol running about in an effort keep this eco miracle working ! 😕 .

[Judd]

This is farcical but without the humour.

So these eco miracles are dependent on your driving further than intended in order to keep them healthy and even then it's a toss up if its going to work, well done,  as insane as having to drive a modern Diesel further than intended to allow the DPF to regenerate, which sounds OK in theory but seeing as the car itself decides if now is the moment to start regen you might drive nowhere 50 miles only for the regen to start just as you pull onto your drive, course something as simple as a message/warning light that regen is about to start would be too much info for the average car buyer according to the makers, perish the thought that a switch to start regen might have been made available.

Can we please stop now it's no longer even slightly amusing, rewind the clock to the 90's and in some cases early noughties when car design and manufacture was at its pinnacle and the entire world hadn't allowed lunatics free rein to ruin everything.

By the way this lunacy is now infesting lorry world, my wagon has a smart charging system which has already killed both batteries @ 2 years, and odd mornings the thing only just starts weeks after new batts were fitted, never had this situation back when things were simpler,

[Siluro]

1 hour ago, Judd said:

This is farcical but without the humour.

So these eco miracles are dependent on your driving further than intended in order to keep them healthy and even then it's a toss up if its going to work, well done,  as insane as having to drive a modern Diesel further than intended to allow the DPF to regenerate, which sounds OK in theory but seeing as the car itself decides if now is the moment to start regen you might drive nowhere 50 miles only for the regen to start just as you pull onto your drive, course something as simple as a message/warning light that regen is about to start would be too much info for the average car buyer according to the makers, perish the thought that a switch to start regen might have been made available.

Can we please stop now it's no longer even slightly amusing, rewind the clock to the 90's and in some cases early noughties when car design and manufacture was at its pinnacle and the entire world hadn't allowed lunatics free rein to ruin everything.

By the way this lunacy is now infesting lorry world, my wagon has a smart charging system which has already killed both batteries @ 2 years, and odd mornings the thing only just starts weeks after new batts were fitted, never had this situation back when things were simpler,

You can apply that to the world. Cars are the least of our problems

[nictriumph]

cars dont switch OFF anymore they just go into standby mode which still uses Battery power...old cars,when you switch off they are OFF now power to anything....might be worse with electric car with all the goodies on it

[Mr B]

56 minutes ago, nictriumph said:

cars dont switch OFF anymore they just go into standby mode which still uses battery power...old cars,when you switch off they are OFF now power to anything....might be worse with electric car with all the goodies on it

Very old cars yes but go back 30 years and you had cars that consume power when locked stationary .
Some would pull around 5 to 20mA which not a big deal, others with more modules, alarms be pulling 15 to 25mA which also acceptable.
Lot of most modern can be 25 to 55mA and more than that if has wake up checks .
Seems to me most vehicle engineers overlooked need for minimal standby Battery drawer and have no criteria on a realistic set standby timespan that the Battery can endure .
I got no idea why many of these modern cars have so much parked current drawer and module activity besides poor engineering and they don't even make any secondary built in trickle charge unit like a solar strip built in sunroof or rear window/spoiler which could improve Battery life at a minimum  .
Unfortunately modern engineering is all about !Removed! you out of your money as cheaply as they possibly can make it   .
 

[Mr B]

5 hours ago, Judd said:

This is farcical but without the humour.

So these eco miracles are dependent on your driving further than intended in order to keep them healthy and even then it's a toss up if its going to work, well done,  as insane as having to drive a modern Diesel further than intended to allow the DPF to regenerate, which sounds OK in theory but seeing as the car itself decides if now is the moment to start regen you might drive nowhere 50 miles only for the regen to start just as you pull onto your drive, course something as simple as a message/warning light that regen is about to start would be too much info for the average car buyer according to the makers, perish the thought that a switch to start regen might have been made available.

Can we please stop now it's no longer even slightly amusing, rewind the clock to the 90's and in some cases early noughties when car design and manufacture was at its pinnacle and the entire world hadn't allowed lunatics free rein to ruin everything.

By the way this lunacy is now infesting lorry world, my wagon has a smart charging system which has already killed both batteries @ 2 years, and odd mornings the thing only just starts weeks after new batts were fitted, never had this situation back when things were simpler,

Don't get me started on DPF's
Absolute madness, storing soot in a can to spit it out on the highway and using immense amount of fuel and complex systems to achieve it .
DPF cost 10 to 15% in possible mpg figures and if engineering had been targeted at fuelling use you looking at 20%+ reduction on diesel mpg .
Engine oil and filter changes are more frequent  due to regen cycle causing diesel in engine oil . (more toxic waste and financial waste)
The systems also consume huge amount of parts in dpf and egr system and harmful chemicals trying clean them to keep operational .
The end result is they creating more pollution rather than less .

What they are very good at is costing you money, a lot of money ...

[Jay762]

1 hour ago, Mr B said:

Don't get me started on DPF's
Absolute madness, storing soot in a can to spit it out on the highway and using immense amount of fuel and complex systems to achieve it .
DPF cost 10 to 15% in possible mpg figures and if engineering had been targeted at fuelling use you looking at 20%+ reduction on diesel mpg .
Engine oil and filter changes are more frequent  due to regen cycle causing diesel in engine oil . (more toxic waste and financial waste)
The systems also consume huge amount of parts in dpf and egr system and harmful chemicals trying clean them to keep operational .
The end result is they creating more pollution rather than less .

What they are very good at is costing you money, a lot of money ...

Hear hear!!

[David James]

Had years of problems with 06 Forester Battery drain. Bought many batteries!

Decided to have alarm siren removed to keep neighbors happy

Whilst disconnecting the mechanic discovered a small back up Battery inside, which was completely flat. He thinks problem solved. I live in hope !

 

I 

 

 

 

 

[Bozzybear]

Hi David, This is our 7th new Subaru in 17 years of Subaru ownership, never had so much as a warranty claim for any of them until now. I strongly suspect the ;lockdown has been the cause of my problems, and now that I am using the car most days I doubt I will suffer a flat Battery again.

[Wilmac1]

Wilmac

Bought an EFB (enhanced flooded battery- Varta N65, 65aH, 650A) for the XT and had no further issues. The removed Battery maintained its voltage for a month after disconnection, proving the issue was with the car discharge load. Changing the car now for an Forester e-boxer and the first thing the garage did was change the Battery for an EFB as per Subaru’s instructions. Will let you know how this goes🤞

[Mr B]

unfortunately Battery swapping is just a band aid covering poor electrical engineering choices on sleep mode activity and parasitic draw values .

I can see same dilemma in 6 to 8 years as the diesel issues which is off to scrap for 300 quid as no repair solution at acceptable cost and owners fed up/bankrupt from constant issues and diagnostic bills .

[Battery victim]

On 3/30/2020 at 6:55 PM, John Horner said:

I bought the new Hybrid Forester mid November 2019, I’ve had the AA out 4 times to start the car, the electronics Battery goes flat after 4 days.  I bought this car as I had a diesel & didn’t use it  as much as I used to, so decided on a petrol vehicle with a larger engine, the Subaru fitted the bill, but then I started having problems with this car the dealership said that I need to drive it more, the salesman knew why I was sell my previous car. The first time I called out the AA I hadn’t driven it for about 7 days, the electronics Battery was flat, most of February the AA was called even though I managed to drive it more often, but that doesn’t seem to make any difference, , I’ve since had the AA engineer out to check it over, on his last visit, I had not used the car for 4 days on purpose so that the engineer could see if there was a problem & there was it had lost its charge, he recommended a stronger Battery which I’ve said to the garage but they just say I’ve got to drive it more, I’ve since had the AA out again & drove it to charge up the Battery, that was last Thursday, I went this morning to move it & the Battery is totally flat, it doesn’t matter now until we are allowed to drive it. Your help Inn sololving this is problem would be very helpful.

All I can say is "Me, too".  This parasitic Battery drain has caused me to have the AA three times in less than 800 miles over six weeks and to need it on trickle charge permanently.  This isn't fit for purpose.  Subaru knew this before the Forrester e boxer was launched in the UK as there is a Class Action in USA and Canada.  It is dangerous, annoying and criminally negligent to put people in this position.  "Drive it more",  they say.  We decide, or should do as purchasers, when we want to drive them.  Grrrrr!

[Mr B]

^ What an environmentally brilliant bit of engineering when you got do wasteful trips just so the thing will keep working and you not chucking another destroyed Battery carcass in the waste centre .
And to think you actually paying painfully earned money for this garbage too !
Get rid of it and buy quality older vehicles that far better engineered and about 3 times the component quality .

[Battery victim]

I should say that I have only had the car the six weekend the Battery has already been changed and Subaru are recommending another Battery change.  I think this is going to end in court, I can't see an alternative unless Subaru do a recall and rectify the issues.

 

[Mr B]

It not just Subau, The Hybrid tech is toyota and german brands such as BMW also have Battery issues.
Simply engineering stupidity with far too much power consumption and poor system and Battery charge status management/engineering all made even worse by general p1ss poor quality of modern car components .
You can buy some of the best made cars ever from late 90's to mid 200's for few grand and they will still have decade of faultless life left in them,
Spend 20 to 40 grand at dealers on newer tech and it painful misery emotionally and financially .
My car is 21 years old, doubt I spend 50 quid a year on parts on average in last decade and I never had a flat Battery seen a CEL fault or broken down .

People need educate themselves to current issue of engineering stupidity/manufactured garbage  and put an end to it by simply being smart enough not to buy it .

I spend roughly 10 hours a day 5 and a half days a week working on this junk and most cars newer than 2008 I wouldn't want if you gave it to me free .

[Guest]

And i thought it was just me

3 year old car and Battery died on me. Fitted new Battery and along came Covid and only driving short distances this Battery goes flat if not driven at least twice a week. Bought Battery charger and used that to top up once a week. Used like that for a while and its now ok provided i drive every week at least 50 miles even if i don't need to. 

No way will I buy an e-forester 

[Mr B]

1 minute ago, chrisletts said:

And i thought it was just me

3 year old car and battery died on me. Fitted new battery and along came Covid and only driving short distances this battery goes flat if not driven at least twice a week. Bought battery charger and used that to top up once a week. Used like that for a while and its now ok provided i drive every week at least 50 miles even if i don't need to. 

No way will I buy an e-forester 

it not just e-forester/subaru, most modern vehicles have lot of issues.

As an engineer I recommend buying older proper made and designed vehicles, new cars are waste of money and material, pretty much constant landfill of parts and unusable junk in in 5 to 10 years

[WRW]

A new 2021 eBoxer XV has same problem Flashing warning lights and bleeps. AA attended and report that there is a Battery issue.

PLEASE everyone write to Chief Technical Officer at SUBARU HQ in SOLIHULL so we have a common VOICE.

This NEEDS to be resolved NOW. Subaru used to =RELIABILITY-not so now it seems.

I notice Legal Cases in USA and Canada on this very issue -ongoing....

[Guest]

My car was going reasonably well on a new Battery provided I drove it 'round the block' at least twice a week.

Then suddenly - wouldn't start. AA transported it to the dealer - verdict 'throttle control unit dead' no replacement stock available apparently and it sat for a month at the dealers until I did an exchange deal on another (non-Subaru) vehicle.

I'm now running a Vauxhall which seems perfectly happy with the occasional use I make of it.

Sorry Subaru but I'll never buy another of your cars..

[Jantay53]

We bought a 2021 Subaru XV ex demo car last October, just before we went on holiday - luckily by taxi - so the car was in the garage for 3 weeks.  The Battery was flat when we came back.  Last week we had a flat Battery on Thursday morning, after the car had been run for about 45 minutes on the Monday.

The first time, the dealership told us it was because it hadn’t been run much. They also mentioned that they leave all the cars in the showroom on trickle charge overnight which I didn’t think anything of at the time. I foolishly accepted this but after last week’s incident, when a very kind neighbour came and jump started us so we could get to the hospital, I’m now beginning to worry - especially after reading the above comments.

We swapped our old Outback for a newer vehicle so we would have more reliability but this, with 6000 miles on the clock, is worse than the old car which had done 98000 miles. Should I go back to the dealer or should I buy a new Battery?

[Mr B]

Very eco friendly these new cars when either got do extra joy rides to top up charge or buy trickle charge equipment and keep them constantly on charge
All the short life batteries nice bit of recycling pollution too lol .
**** poor engineering and completely unfit for purpose if can't leave them unused for over a month .
Personally I would take it back and ask for money back, then go buy a proper engineered and built subaru from 1997 to 2005 year range cherry picking best used example you can find . Bank the saved money and live hassle free for a decade plus .
Newer vehicles are waste of money and waste of time dealing with the faults & listening to dealer excuses  ...