Dodgy brakes, thought brembos would be awesome :(

[Fuggzy]

Hey everyone, me again lol

I've got the standard fit brembo's all round on my hawkeye. And to put it bluntly, they're rubbish.

I've not really given the car a good pasting properly yet because they give me no confidence.

Don't get me wrong they work ok, but they're not great. I don't have the cash to splash out on a set of new up rated brakes. But I could get some new pads, which is what I'm hoping is wrong. The cars not LED a hard life and it's been looked after. But from what I can tell it's just had cheap pads from a local motor factors slapped in. Can any of you suggest some decent brake pads for it pls? The discs look fine. And I will look to replace those shortly. But some decent pads should step it up a bit. The pedal is strong and has good feel, so that's why I've narrowed it down to pads

[Fuggzy]

Actually, looking a bit closer at that pic, the discs look pretty scored. So if anyone could suggest a disc and pad combo that will work better but not make me bankrupt I'd appreciate it

[Scooby Pete]

1st option and cheapest is to change the pads. I have always used EBC pads from ecb direct.com good price quick delivery.

Upgrading the brake pads will give you better more positive braking.

The only reason to change the discs is if:

The steering wheel wobbles under hard or prolonged braking. This means the discs are warped, and you should really replace them.

The discs are badly worn and you have a produced lip around the edge of the disc. You could get these skimmed, or replace them.

I will have to change my discs as I noticed they have quite a bit of wobble when braking from 100 down to 50 without really braking that hard. I'm going to go for EBC turbo Grooved discs, with EBC yellow stuff (fast street/track) or more likely the Red Stuff pads (street/fast street)

I ran both types of pads on my classics and felt the red stuff were the better option if your not raggin it a lot and just driving normally with a bit of playing about every now and then. If you are going rag it a lot then the yellow stuff would suit better, still work ok as an every day brake pad but you have to ask is it worth the extra £35 for the yellow stuff pads.

[Fuggzy]

I had been looking at EBC pads to be honest, they looked good value. Skimming the discs sounds good, but I suppose that would rely on how much meat is left on there to skim. Because I've not fitted the discs myself I don't know what quality they are.

How long does it take to bed in a set of EBC pads?

[Jay762]

I

How long does it take to bed in a set of EBC pads?

 

opinion is divided - some say a steady 50-100 miles of driving but IMO x2 hard brake checks and you are good to go inside 5 miles ;)

 

echo the ebc statements have got Brembo discs and pads on mine and I think they are too wooden and fade is terrible after just 1 brake check I will be going EBC yellow pad (used them before) and braided brake hoses all round as soon as funds permit

[Miggs]

I have had a quick skim read over what was said and it looks like scooby Pete has said what I was thinking, I know a guy that builds and races short wheelbase land rovers, he commented once on my drilled and grooved discs with stock pads, he said he only upgrades his pads, never his discs, he uses EBC pads, I have used the greenstuff ones in the past and they are awesome, it's one thing I'll be investing in at some point, also for certain models of impreza tegiwa do a thing called a brake flex stopper, when you brakes the bulkhead is that thin it bends under pressure loosing the stopping power you have, for £30-40 you can get them on eBay, my mate has one on his bugeye and it works !Removed! well, also on other cars I've had the braided brake lines are worth investing in, standard rubber ones tend to expand slightly when braking, good ridge braided ones stay the same so better braking, if you upgrade the discs, stock ones are goodfor general driving, if you are on and off the brakes a lot in a run you will get brake fade, this is the only time you should bother getting drilled and grooved tbh

[Fuggzy]

Hey everyone, just thought I'd give you an update on the old crappy brake front. I got a complete set of EBC Red Stuff Ceramic Fast Road pads for the front and rear AND EBC TGD Front Discs and TGD Rear Discs. So fingers crossed they'll be a little better :)

[Miggs]

just make sure you degrease the new discs and give the pads about 200 miles of normal driving before you start heavy braking, just gives them time to bed in, also be aware that EBC pads need to be warm to get the full effect

[Fuggzy]

Yeah, I've got all the bits and bobs to do it. I was hoping to do it all in a one. I've got the coilovers already, was thinking about whipping the suspension in, the brakes on, and then maybe slap the 19's on and see how they fit. The tyres on the standard sti wheels are getting close to need replacing, and I have those other split rims that are I'm intending to rebuild. But I have those 19's just sat around and they may or may not fit. If they don't ill have some head scratching to do tyre wise. I'm not wanting to have to buy 2 sets of tyres

[Miggs]

if they are too tight under the arches you could roll the arches to get a bit more clearance, suspension is a doddle to take and and refit, can all be done in a few hours, i swapped my 2 pots for 4 pots and discs all at the same time, i found it easier to remove the disc, caliper and carrier all as one unit and fit the new stuff the same way

[Fuggzy]

Do you know if I need a wind back tool to wind the pistons back ?? Or can I pop the lid from the reservoir and squeeze them back with a clamp or something

[Jay762]

I just used my fingers on mine - there shouldnt be a huge resistance - make sure you have your car in gear and hand brake off though ;)

[Scooby Pete]

Likewise, I do it by hand with a peice of wood across the pistons.

[Gambit]

Should be able to do it with your hands unless you have a stuck pistone then it's game on sorting that out. I had to take the break fluid filler cap off and use a really long bar so I could get enough pull behind it. touch wood (touch's head) not had a problem since. 

[Adam]

Brembo brakes are awesome but brakes are only as good as the weakest link. Disc, pads, lines and fluid also play a huge part. When was the last time you changed the brake fluid? The standard rubber lines go off over time and rubber is disolved into the fluid giving a spongy feel. Also, if the brakes have been cooked in the past the fluid will never fully recover. Get yourself a set of good quality aftermarket brake lines (HEL for example) and when you change them flush all the old fluid out and replace with new 5.1 DOT.

Once you have done that, you will be able to get the best from whatever discs and pads you choose to fit.

No an issue for you, but the New Age master cylinder is much better than the design fitted to the Classic, so for owners of the older cars this is also a great upgrade.

[Miggs]

also a brake flex stopper as the bulkheads quite thin and flexes under braking

 

as for winding back, general rule is if the piston has 2 groves on it then it will need winding, if its flat all round it's just a push

[Miggs]

that's one that needs winding, see the grooves?

 

 

that one doesn't, no grooves

[Gambit]

I have cooked mine on a track day, I didn't know it killed the oil. another job for one weekend :D

[Scooby Pete]

Braided Hoses are a good idea, Grahame Goode Racing 0116 244 0080 make up hoses to order. £35 for a pair of Front braided Brake hoses.

[Gambit]

Cheers Pete I remember you saying the rubber hoses are crap before and £35 cheaper then I thought :) 

[Miggs]

i've had braided hoses on some of my VW's in the past and it's surprising what a difference it makes, mine were goodridge ones, not cheap but worth the expense

[Gambit]

I think it's something I will replace I was telling Jay before I was at my local track went to over take someone coming onto a bend had to break hard and the dam thing just cooked. Bit of butt flexing around the bend I just made it. on the outside I was like cool as a cucumber  -_- but my pants was stained :D And after that I really didn't fancy wanting to  break lap times 

[Fuggzy]

I know this sounds silly, but ill replace the fluid once the pads are bedded in. That way I can't put too much pressure on them with the dodgy fluid (it probably needs replacing) ill also get one of them master cylinder brace wotsits. I've got a bloke interested in my 19's so I may have to sort out a refurb on the new wheels sharpish. If any of you can refurb wheels on the cheap and could help I'd greatly appreciate it

[Miggs]

The only decent refurb place I know is near blackpool, cheap and a fantastic job too

[Miggs]

When bleeding brakes, if your not using a pressurised system and your, or someone you, are pumping the pedal you should NEVER press all the way to the floor, inside the servo there's a plunger, even under harsh braking the plunger will never travel all the way, over whatever miles that cars done, small amounts of crap build up just after the furthest travel of the plunger, when there'sno pressure in the system due to it being bled, by pushing to the floor you are in effect taking that plunger through the crud, this can sometimes cause the plunger, or even the seal if you push it far enough, to corrode or split causing a loss in pressure when applying the brakes, that will mean a new servo will need fitting

That's something a mechanic of 35 years taught me and it's always stuck, I try and use a pressurised system where possible, the master cylinder cap on a subie is not a screw down cap, if you get a pressurised bleeding system like the eazi bleed system there's nothing for you to keep the cap on the master cylinderunder pressure, the more expensive kits come with a chain to fasten round, if you get the cheap one just use a long or a couple of shorter cable ties to keep the cap on, thick good quality ties are best, even better are reusable ones tthat have a little tab on to release